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Guillaume de Lorris

Autor(a) de The Romance of the Rose

15+ Works 1,220 Membros 14 Críticas 1 Favorited
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About the Author

Image credit: From Wikipedia

Obras por Guillaume de Lorris

Associated Works

Etiquetado

Conhecimento Comum

Data de nascimento
c. 1210
Data de falecimento
c. 1237
Sexo
male
Nacionalidade
France
Local de nascimento
Lorris, Loiret, Centre, Frankrijk
Locais de residência
France
Ocupações
poet
scholar

Membros

Discussions

Buddy Read - Roman de la Rose em Club Read 2023 (Abril 2023)

Críticas

As its existence and history as a highly popular early medieval text, I enjoyed knowing I've read this looooong poem and taking a deeper look at how it reflects medieval attitudes and ideas on love and romance. The allegorical aspect was well done, if a little heavy handed from the view of a modern reader. I liked looking backwards from this text and seeing the influences from Ovid and Greek works, as well as looking forwards and seeing how writers like Chaucer took inspiration from this.

The worst part of this book (again, from a modern standpoint) was the fact that characters had monologues that went on for AGES. We're talking 50 pages here. It was incredibly tedious to get through at times! But I also understand that these detailed monologues were a new thing in developing medieval Western romance and would have been a novelty to hear read, so I don't completely dislike it. I'm just saying it's a read that you've gotta commit to or you're just gonna get lost in the pages and pages and PAGES of speeches.

Like I said, I'm glad I read it! I don't think I'll ever reread the entire poem cover to cover again, but I am going to take a few more zoomed-in looks at the more interesting passages. :)
… (mais)
 
Assinalado
deborahee | 10 outras críticas | Feb 23, 2024 |
Only blank verse translation I'm aware of.
 
Assinalado
judeprufrock | 10 outras críticas | Jul 4, 2023 |
23. The Romance of the Rose by Guillaume de Lorris & Jean de Meun
translation and notes: from Old French by Frances Horgan (1994)
written: circa 1230/1275
format: 365-page Oxford World Classic paperback
acquired: January read: Mar 3 – Apr 7 time reading: 21:34, 3.6 mpp
rating: 4
genre/style: medieval literature theme: Chaucer
locations: mythological garden
about the author: Guillaume de Lorris (c. 1200 – c. 1240). He is named within as the author of the first 4,058 verses, otherwise nothing is known about him. Jean de Meun, author of the remaining 17,724 verses, lived c1240-1305.

There is a terrific review of the same edition of this book on this page by LT user baswood, from 2011. I'll have to leave you to his review to capture the essence.

This was a really influential work. Dante and Chaucer, in particular took this in. Chaucer translated it from Middle French to his own Middle English in the late 1300s. The book is a simple story - a youth, in a dream, stumbles upon a magical garden of dancing immortals. Pleasure, Joy, and so on, fulfil their names. Love is there too, with a quill of arrows. Our youth, firmly struck by five different of Love's arrows, falls deeply in love with a "rose". But when he kisses the rose immortals of very different leanings appear, Jealousy, Shame, Fear, etc, and they react in anger, send him away, and build a fortress around the rose. The youth, now lovesick, strives to find a way back to his rose and appeals to the god of Love.

The work has its own little story. One author, [[Guillaume de Lorris]], otherwise unknown, wrote a short incomplete opening in his own French. Then 40 years later another author, [[Jean de Meun]], associated with the Paris university, expanded and completed it, without changing any of the essential story elements. There is no documentary evidence of this origin story, other than that the work itself states this, and that it changes tone. It opens light, creative, and fun. Then the monologues become really really long. [[Jean de Meun]]'s section keeps the tone light, but he expands the monologues, touching on various philosophical ideas. It gets slow in places.

It's a playful work in several ways. There is, of course, the romance and sex. It gets very explicit, even if the wording is allegorical. But the philosophy is a game touching on serious stuff. The university in Paris was in some controversy at the time between, on one hand, devoutly religious strict scholars, and, on the other, liberal, lay, perhaps even atheist, scholars. There was real bitterness, with scholars getting excommunicated and exiled out of France. [[Jean de Meun]] was playing with some of the more serious ideas getting tossed about. But he's messing around. The references he cites are often misused, or not relevant. The ideas his characters work out get very convoluted, and it's hard to believe this wasn't made confusing by playful intent. In a way it was a Monty Python or Terry Pratchett of its own time - intelligent, fun, irreverent, and impudent.

The idea of tihs is wonderful. The execution will vary with the reader and their mood. I was ok with it but did not fall in love.

2023
https://www.librarything.com/topic/348551#8115253
… (mais)
3 vote
Assinalado
dchaikin | 10 outras críticas | Apr 10, 2023 |
Uno de esos clásicos de la literatura medieval que "hay que leer" pero que, la verdad, antes hay que enterarse un poco. Y en ese sentido es muy buena la introducción, breve pero suficiente para que le lector sepa a qué atenerse. El poeta, en un sueño, se encuentra en un paisaje idílico y topa con un jardín cerrado. En sus muros hay pìntadas actitudes que a la vez impiden el acceso al jardín y además ellas mismas están siempre fuera de él. Hasta que el poeta encuentra una rendija y es introducido por "Ociosidad". Por lo visto, el jardín es el mundo del amor cortés, estupendo pero bastante cerrado. El poeta se encuentra con diversas actitudes positivas, especialmente con "Dulce Albergue" (por cierto, personificado en un hombre) que acaban enseñándole "la rosa", lo más preciado y oculto. El poeta, completamente enamorado, pide a su amado un beso, y este se indigna. Aquí acaba la primera parte, escrita por Lorris. La segunda parte, obra de Meun, es muchísimo más larga y en ella aparecen los enemigos del poeta (como Mala Lengua o Celos), que encierran la rosa en lo más profundo de un castillo donde también meten a Dulce Albergue. Para rescatar a este y poder coger aquella, el poeta encuentra muchos enemigos, como los ya citados, que le sermonean o le insultan, pero también amigos, como Naturaleza o Amor, que le ayudan en las batallas, hasta que consigue liberar a Dulce Albergue y coger la rosa, despertando finalmente de su sueño.

Obviamente, todo es alegórico y su significado real suele ser bastante evidente (así la escena final, cuando "toma la rosa" narrando todos los detalles). La primera parte, para mi gusto, es bastante más fresca y fue escrita en la primera mitad del siglo XIII exaltando el amor cortés. Algunos párrafos, como los "mandamientos del amor" resultan bastante divertidos ("vístete bien, pero no te arruines, y lleva siempre las manos limpias"). La segunda parte, escrita una generación después, se alarga demasiado. Carlos Alvar dice que, por un lado, el amor cortés ha cedido el paso a cierto cinismo y materialismo que no cree en las virtudes de las damas y menos en las de los caballeros; y que, por otro lado, Meun trata de alargar el texto mediante frecuentes y largas digresiones, pero que precisamente estas digresiones son su principal valor, porque puede hablar de casi cualquier cosa. Y es verdad que los diferentes discursos de los personajes empiezan con tema erótico pero pueden acabar hablando de astronomía, de cocina, de teología o de cualquier otra cosa. Y hay escenas más movidas, como los dos asaltos al castillo, descritos como si fuesen batallas reales, o algunos excursos más graciosos, como aquél en el que el poeta reprocha a Razón (que suelta un tremendo sermonaco, por cierto) el uso de palabras malsonantes, impropias de una dama, y ella se defiende con soltura.

En fin, que es una buena obra, a veces aburrida pero con momentos divertidos, y que solo se aprecia con algo de ayuda. ¡Ah, se me olvidaba! Esta edición, muy cuidada como todas las de Siruela, incluye algunas deliciosas miniaturas de uno de los ejemplares medievales, con un breve y acertado comentario.
… (mais)
½
 
Assinalado
caflores | 10 outras críticas | Jan 29, 2021 |

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Associated Authors

Frances Horgan Translator, Introduction
Milton Glaser Cover designer
Ernst van Altena Translator
Manfred Krüger Translator
Harry W. Robbins Translator

Estatísticas

Obras
15
Also by
1
Membros
1,220
Popularidade
#21,044
Avaliação
½ 3.4
Críticas
14
ISBN
54
Línguas
11
Marcado como favorito
1

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