Prisoner of Azkaban chapters 13-16 discussion

The adventure continues! Let's talk about chapters 13-16 of Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban. Those chapters are:

Gryffindor Versus Ravenclaw

Snape's Grudge

The Quidditch Final

Professor Trelawney's Prediction

Have at it!

A few quick thoughts, before my morning meeting starts (I'll come back later with more):

Lots of Quidditch action in these chapters.

And, of course you'll be expecting me to mention chapter 14, my favorite of this batch for obvious reasons. I think this is our first real hint of certain events that are revealed in book 7.

Gotta go!

So much happens in this portion of the book, especially things that are important later. Yet, I wrote no notes in the margins. I think I was just carried away by the story. It's tightly plotted through here, not much filler. Not like the last 4 books (cough, cough).

I'll have to skim and write more later.

I actually felt Harry having the firebolt is a bit of an unfair advantage in the books. Before it was Harry's hard work and native talent but now he also has superior sports equipment.

I remember when I first read it I thought Cho was fairly clever to mark Harry knowing that he had a faster broom.

lg I agree about the tighter plotting. I think this book is very well plotted. It has to be to go back in time and repeat it with out making errors.

foggi I also love the revealing information about the adults.

It leaves me wondering if wizards are a more inclined toward dangerous activities since things like bones and wounds can be healed more easily than their muggle counterparts. It seems like the stunt played on Snape was not only very malicious and but very dangerous as well.

I think it is interesting the role that prophecy plays in the books. Trelawney is mocked consistently and yet has at least 2 real predictions. Harry is consistently striving against his presumed doom (the grim, telling the mirror at hogsmede he wasn't going to die etc.) but at the same time fullfilling it. There is an interesting argument to be had about free will and predestination in Harry Potter but I am not sure I am up to starting it yet.

I think Rowling likes to have it both ways. We like a hero with his own volition but we also need to know he is special, chosen and fated. But it isn't interesting if we know how things are going to turn out.

Great post, maren.

As to prophecy, generally I hate the "one special kid and his special prophecy" devices, but the reason it works here is that, although everyone knows about the Voldy incident, very few people even know there was a prophecy. That helps, tho I'm not sure why. I love that JKR leaves some ambiguity regarding prophecy in general. Just like real life, you can look at it different ways, and sometimes, it just might be real.

More notes on the chapters:

Hermione is behaving very much like a 13-year-old. She's moody, quick to take offense and generally obnoxious. I hated that year of my life.

I always hoped Crookshanks would turn out to be Lily's animagus form. Oh well.

First Cho Chang siting. I'm glad we get to hear about what an awesome quidditch player she is before we find out she's pretty. I never noticed before, but Harry "Tao of Steve's" Cho--he's desireless (of her at least), he's excellent in her presence (conjuring up a patronus without a second thought) and he's gone (winning the match and off with the other Gryffindors). No wonder Cho got the hots for him!

OK what was Sirius thinking wandering around the Gryffindor dorms carrying a knife? Steal or somehow get ahold of a wand, kill him with your bare hands (or jaws, when a dog). Don't go endangering innocent children with a knife! Poor Ron! Can you imagine?

Neville, Neville...almost as willing to provide convenient plot points as Hagrid.

Speaking of Hagrid, it's so touching that he sticks up for Hermione. Boys are such dolts!

Love the scene where Harry beats up Malfoy & co. I actually liked the way it was staged in the movie, with Ron & Hermione not knowing Harry was there at first. R&H were not fighting so much in the movie, they hang out a lot.

It's another case where Harry should have been expelled. Sometimes I really sympathize with Snape & Malfoy on that one.

I love the Snapey goodness in Chpt 14. He's completely right about James and Harry, they are arrogant and both get away with murder. I would be just as angry if I were Snape. The insults on the map are great.

Lupin to the rescue. At this point he still thinks Sirius is guilty. I get the sense he still has a sense of loyalty to his old friends, maybe hoping all is not as it seems. He never did tell Dumbledore about their illicit animagus status, even though it is key to finding Sirius and he must know it.

Love the way he alludes to the truth without giving anything away or alarming Harry. Harry ignores his sensible admonitions, of course.

More later.

Wow, I can't believe no one cares about PoA. Even I only did the first two chapters on the list.

Should we just jump ahead to DH?

IF...we jump ahead we should jump to GoF, PoA is not my favorite anyway

I'm sorry, littlegeek! I've been terrible at these reading discussions. :(

I was just thinking that since PoA is many people's favourite (including mine), what they really want is to just do DH. Maybe since it's a favourite they have no criticism. There's always criticism as far a I am concerned, but I'm cranky.

I could go either way. I'm going to reread the series anyway.

I honestly want to reread the series, not simply DH. The entire series will have a different feel to it now that we've read DH. I think I've simply read too much (goodness, how?) Harry Potter this year. I did a pre 07/21 reading, read some reference books on the series, and now it does feel a little soon to me to do a complete rereading. But it's slow paced, which is helpful because I can then read HP on the side of other books. I've just been lazy about it. I think I'm going to have some quiet time tomorrow while my family is gone. I'm going to try to catch up on PoA while they're gone once I'm off work.

Why don't we finish the PoA discussion on schedule, then wait until the beginning of next year to start the next book? I doubt anyone will have time to read during the holidays, anyway, and we can start GoF in January.

As far as skipping to DH, I'd prefer not to. Let's stick with the series for a while longer.

What does everyone else think?

We might as well stick with it, but I like the idea of waiting until January for GoF.

And we have foggi's excellent recap thread, so anyone who wants to revive the threads in the future can do so.

I like that idea. Everyone is going to be so usy, they either won't have time to read or they won't have time to chat (or both). And I definately want to read through the whole series before going back to DH. That really drained me emotionally, and I want to wait before I go through it again.

I think it is definite overall business that is contributing to the lack of discussion. I love PoA but I am really busy right now. I did contribute a long post above.

I have been thinking that Sirius attacking the painting and having the knife in the tower are a bit out of place and extreme and noone ever really goes back to them in the plot except to say "his actions have not been those of an innocent man"

LG I agree with you on the staging of the invisible Harry in hogsmede. I liked the movie better. I actually think Cuaron is the best filmically of the directors thus far. I loved the grey blue palate and the real expanded sense of Hogwarts and the magical he has. Plus he was a breath of fresh air after Chris "Home Alone" Columbus.

I'm in for waiting *not that I've actually been reading cuz I start to get melancholy when I look at those books, or movies* btu you never know, new year, maybe I'll actually read one

sorry I haven't been around this week. been busy.

I just realized that I never came back to this thread with full thoughts on these chapters. So much good stuff was said early on by Maren and LG, though, that at this point I can't think of much to add. I do feel that there's little I can give in the way of criticism. For one thing, it's a pretty tight plot, especially in these climactic chapters, and for another, my brain is currently just about fried. By the middle of next week, I may be thinking more clearly, as I'll have most of my big projects behind me (and all of you who are weary of hearing me whinge about school can then listen to me whinge about job hunting).

Okay, so what I'm hearing is that we're going to finish up PoA in the next two weeks, then take a couple of weeks off and start GoF in January? If that's the case, here's my weekly reminder: read chapters 17-20 for Monday's discussion!

#11 foggi:
That sounds good to me. :)

#17 Letta:
So much that you posted twice. ;) Hehe, sorry! :)