Página InicialGruposDiscussãoMaisZeitgeist
Pesquisar O Sítio Web
Este sítio web usa «cookies» para fornecer os seus serviços, para melhorar o desempenho, para analítica e (se não estiver autenticado) para publicidade. Ao usar o LibraryThing está a reconhecer que leu e compreende os nossos Termos de Serviço e Política de Privacidade. A sua utilização deste sítio e serviços está sujeita a essas políticas e termos.
Hide this

Resultados dos Livros Google

Carregue numa fotografia para ir para os Livros Google.

A.D. 381: Heretics, Pagans, and the Dawn of…
A carregar...

A.D. 381: Heretics, Pagans, and the Dawn of the Monotheistic State (original 2008; edição 2010)

por Charles Freeman (Autor)

MembrosCríticasPopularidadeAvaliação médiaMenções
240684,812 (3.7)17
"In AD. 381, Theodosius, emperor of the eastern Roman empire, issued a decree in which all his subjects were required to subscribe to a belief in the Trinity of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. This edict defined Christian orthodoxy and brought to an end a lively and wide-ranging debate about the nature of God; all other interpretations were now declared heretical. It was the first time in a thousand years of Greco-Roman civilization that free thought was unambiguously suppressed. Yet surprisingly, the popular histories claim that the Christian Church reached a consensus on the Trinity at the Council of Constantinople in AD. 381. Why has Theodosius's revolution been airbrushed from the historical record?" "In this book, acclaimed historian Charles Freeman shows that the Council of Constantinople was in fact a sham, only taking place after Theodosius's decree had already become law, The Church was acquiescing to the overwhelming power of the emperor - and the council was a cover-up." "Still, the problem ran even deeper. Freeman argues that Theodosius's edict and the subsequent suppression of paganism not only brought an end to the diversity of religious and philosophical beliefs throughout the empire, but created numerous theological problems for the Church - problems which remain unsolved to this day. The year AD. 381, as Freeman puts it, was "a turning point which time forgot.""--BOOK JACKET.… (mais)
Membro:LPierson
Título:A.D. 381: Heretics, Pagans, and the Dawn of the Monotheistic State
Autores:Charles Freeman (Autor)
Informação:Overlook Books (2010), Edition: Reprint, 272 pages
Colecções:A sua biblioteca
Avaliação:
Etiquetas:church history

Pormenores da obra

A.D. 381 : heretics, pagans, and the dawn of the monotheistic state por Charles Freeman (2008)

Nenhum(a)
A carregar...

Adira ao LibraryThing para descobrir se irá gostar deste livro.

Ainda não há conversas na Discussão sobre este livro.

» Ver também 17 menções

Mostrando 1-5 de 6 (seguinte | mostrar todos)
It's unfortunate, but perhaps not unexpected, that for the first time in the history of Greco-Roman civilization, a ruler issued an edict that destroyed free thought and free exercise of religion. That it was in support of Christianity was perhaps also not unexpected. The edict` of Theodosius in 381 A.D (some historians say 380) forbade belief and practice of any religious practice that did not recognize the singularity of the "godhead," i.e. the idea of the Trinity as solidified at the Council of Nicea in 325 under Constantine -- they were equal in majesty (whatever the Hell that means.) This edict and the removal of the Bishop of Constantinople, an adherent of Arianism, a belief Jesus was created at a point in time, divine, but subject to the Father. (I get shivers of ridiculousness and have to restrain my natural tendency to overheat my crap detector as I recount some of this. Nevertheless it's quite interesting.) Freeman argues that Theodosius' edict and the subsequent suppression of paganism not only brought an end to the diversity of religious and philosophical beliefs throughout the empire but created numerous theological problems for the Church, which have remained unsolved. The year AD 381, Freeman concludes, marked 'a turning point which time forgot'.



The biggest issue was whether Jesus was God. It took a substantial amount of twisting to

figure out how the Trinity was supposed to work, the Aryans arguing that if Jesus was God then there was no sacrifice on the cross, the Athanasians supporting Trinitarianism. One of the hurdles for Trinitarians was Mark 13:32 when Jesus was to have said ""“But concerning that day or that hour, no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." This was interpreted to mean that Jesus was not God.



This book was theologically much more detailed than When Jesus Became God by Richard Rubenstein [https://www.goodreads.com/review/show/37674110] which deals with the same topic. Freeman continued his discussion more extensively in his book The Closing of the Western Mind: The Rise of Faith and the Fall of Reason, an examination of the effects of events covered in AD 381. ( )
  ecw0647 | Jan 30, 2021 |
Read from February 24 to March 20, 2014, read count: 1

This book opened my eyes to what happened during the Fourth Century and the part the government played in stopping the dialogue between the various different groups involved in trying to decide what would be orthodox and what would be heterodox.

Freeman calls this the closing of the Western Mind and even wrote a book on that, which I plan to read soon! ( )
  homericgeek | Apr 14, 2014 |
This is an interesting and well written book about Christianity in its early years as a dominant religion. I learned a lot from it, and found many of its arguments convincing, though there are some points on which the author may overstate his case. All in all, well worth reading.

The book argues a) that the Emperor Theodosius imposed a single version of Christianity at the Council of Constantinople in 381, and that b) this imposition was a critical turning away from freedom of thought, and from a reliance on reasoned argument.

The author's argument about Theodosius' key role make sense: Christianity had vaulted very suddenly to its place as Rome's dominant religion, and it is not surprising that the emperor tried to shape its direction. It was just 68 years earlier, in 313, that Constantine issued an edict of toleration for the faith: before then Christianity was apersecuted religion, existing in many separate congregations, and developing many different approaches to key problems of the faith. Once the faith came out into the open -- and, indeed, came to a central role -- fissures and divisions became vividly clear. These contributed to civil disorder, and Theodosius did not like disorder.

The argument that this specific decision shut down a free-wheeling culture of debate is perhaps too narrow. I haven't read the author's "Closing of the Western Mind", but I intend to. My impression from reviews is that "Closing" focusses on Constantine's support of the Church, which moved it from outsider status towards a role as state religion. This process was intensified under Thodosius, and the logic of an imperial autocracy pushed the Church towards a single, codified set of beliefs. It seems to me that the process, the politicization of the Church and the sacralization of politics, was well underway before Theodosius. I will be better able to comment after reading Freeman's earlier book.

Be that as it may, this is a very valuable book. First, it clarifies key issues in the development of Christianity. Secondly, it underlines the interaction between political forces and systems of faith -- something that not begin in 381, and hasn't ended today. Finally, it's a good read. I read it right after "Jesus Wars", which is a more nitty-gritty discussion of a slightly later phase in the intra-Christian conflicts that were addressed, but not resolved, in 381. ( )
  annbury | Nov 4, 2012 |
Wonderful...heretics, pagans and the dawn of the monotheistic state, some of my most favorite things!! ( )
  Harrod | Aug 11, 2011 |
One of the main points of this book, which is that Rome had succeeded due to its flexibility and that Theodosius' decree imposing the Niceaen Creed was directly antithetical to that, hits its mark. Inasmuch as what intellectual freedom existed in 300 AD was abolished by 476 AD, the fusion of Church with State was a novel approach with profound consequences.

But Freeman leaves two glaring gaps which need to be addressed. First, he never considers the spectrum of intellectual freedom which exists in all functional societies, which spans from limited liberty to destructive and irreconcilable license. Second, he does not fully consider the possibility that Theodosius had much more pressing issues to take care of and was simply fed up with the repeated disputes, mostly violent, about trifling philosophical minutiae (Freeman mentions this in bits and pieces but does not address why this may have justified Theodosius' position). Certainly as regards the first of these, he is quick to criticize Gibbon for believing the intellectual dynamism of antiquity to be extinguished well before 381, but not quick to acknowledge that Gibbon believed this because Plotinus is more or less unintelligible (and I have read Plotinus), because there is no poet even remotely approaching Virgil and no historian resembling in the slightest Tacitus, Plutarch, or Livy dating from 150 until 1320, when Dante becomes the first great Renaissance poet. For 200 years then, the intellectual world appeared to be in heavy swing, but was not procuding anything truly worthwhile.

Much bigger than any of these issues, however, is Freeman's barbarous abuses of the English language. He uses the wrong words at times ("Processes" was repeatedly used where he meant "proceeds"), the wrong tenses of verbs at times, poorly considers what voice he is using, often winding up in passive voice when active would be much clearer. What this amounts to is a lack of clarity of mind, and a lack of clarity of thought, which is further reflected in his narrative, which is out of chronological order and at times confusing as hell.

I still believe this is a valuable book and considers an extremely important historical topic, but it contains many major flaws and would have benefited from a more substantial consideration of the thoughts of the British Enlightenment. All of the flaws I have here noted are more marked in contrast with Gibbon (as noted and also he shows a good way to consider historical events chronologically) and Hume (who has strong remarks on liberty/license), and the language is of course used exceptionally clearly in all of those writings, especially Smith, Hume, Locke, and others. ( )
1 vote jrgoetziii | Apr 11, 2011 |
Mostrando 1-5 de 6 (seguinte | mostrar todos)
sem críticas | adicionar uma crítica
Tem de autenticar-se para poder editar dados do Conhecimento Comum.
Para mais ajuda veja a página de ajuda do Conhecimento Comum.
Título canónico
Informação do Conhecimento Comum em inglês. Edite para a localizar na sua língua.
Título original
Títulos alternativos
Data da publicação original
Pessoas/Personagens
Informação do Conhecimento Comum em inglês. Edite para a localizar na sua língua.
Locais importantes
Informação do Conhecimento Comum em inglês. Edite para a localizar na sua língua.
Acontecimentos importantes
Filmes relacionados
Prémios e menções honrosas
Epígrafe
Dedicatória
Primeiras palavras
Citações
Últimas palavras
Nota de desambiguação
Editores da Editora
Autores de citações elogiosas (normalmente na contracapa do livro)
Língua original
DDC/MDS canónico

Referências a esta obra em recursos externos.

Wikipédia em inglês (1)

"In AD. 381, Theodosius, emperor of the eastern Roman empire, issued a decree in which all his subjects were required to subscribe to a belief in the Trinity of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. This edict defined Christian orthodoxy and brought to an end a lively and wide-ranging debate about the nature of God; all other interpretations were now declared heretical. It was the first time in a thousand years of Greco-Roman civilization that free thought was unambiguously suppressed. Yet surprisingly, the popular histories claim that the Christian Church reached a consensus on the Trinity at the Council of Constantinople in AD. 381. Why has Theodosius's revolution been airbrushed from the historical record?" "In this book, acclaimed historian Charles Freeman shows that the Council of Constantinople was in fact a sham, only taking place after Theodosius's decree had already become law, The Church was acquiescing to the overwhelming power of the emperor - and the council was a cover-up." "Still, the problem ran even deeper. Freeman argues that Theodosius's edict and the subsequent suppression of paganism not only brought an end to the diversity of religious and philosophical beliefs throughout the empire, but created numerous theological problems for the Church - problems which remain unsolved to this day. The year AD. 381, as Freeman puts it, was "a turning point which time forgot.""--BOOK JACKET.

Não foram encontradas descrições de bibliotecas.

Descrição do livro
Resumo Haiku

Ligações Rápidas

Capas populares

Avaliação

Média: (3.7)
0.5
1 1
1.5
2 1
2.5
3 9
3.5 1
4 14
4.5 2
5 4

É você?

Torne-se num Autor LibraryThing.

 

Acerca | Contacto | LibraryThing.com | Privacidade/Termos | Ajuda/Perguntas Frequentes | Blogue | Loja | APIs | TinyCat | Bibliotecas Legadas | Primeiros Críticos | Conhecimento Comum | 157,906,017 livros! | Barra de topo: Sempre visível